For : Catholics and other denomiantion who call their elders "father".?
March 15th, 2010 by roseIs there any reason for such traditions?
Mat 23:9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.
Mat 23:10 Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.
Why do our answers even matter to you anyway? You're not looking for the truth about what we believe, you're just looking for another Protestant fundamentalist to come in and confirm your own shaky beliefs for you.
I was raised a Protestant...in fact, my father is a minister...I became Catholic for a reason, mostly because of people like you.
P.S. And what about "Father Abraham"? I know you probably sang that song in Sunday school or something as a kid..."Father Abraham had many sons, many sons had Father Abraham, I am one of them, and so are you, so let's all praise the Lord."
I suppose singing that song makes all the little Protestant children the Devil because they refer to Abraham as "Father."
For I became your father in Christ Jesus through the gospel. (1Cor.4:15)
So, I'm not supposed to call my biological father "father" ?
What does the english dictionary say the word "father" means ? Let's see...............
Father noun
1. a male parent.
2. a father-in-law, stepfather, or adoptive father.
3. any male ancestor, esp. the founder of a race, family, or line; progenitor.
4. a man who exercises paternal care over other persons; paternal protector or provider: a father to the poor.
It would seem that your bible is in disagreement with the english dictionary !
Some Evangelicals point to the Scripture passage "Call no man your father?" (Mat 23:9-10) as a reason not to call priests "father." Yet in the same sentence Jesus says "Nor are you to be called instructors, for you have one instructor, the Messiah." Using this passage to claim that we cannot call a priest "father" would mean that we could not call professors at an Evangelical Bible college "instructors." If we were to take this passage literally, it would mean that I could not call my earthly dad "father" either.
Catholics don't believe Jesus was forbidding the use of "father" in that passage. There are plenty of examples in the Bible where that the word "Father" applies to humans, and the Bible links the priesthood to fatherhood. Fr. Mateo writes:
In Judges 17:10, the Ephraimite Micah asks a transient Levite, "Stay with me; be father and priest to me." Later (Judges 18:19), a Danite war party persuades the same Levite to leave Micah, saying: "Come with us and be our father and priest." Indeed, the Bible finds priesthood and fatherhood inseparably united.
St. Paul says he is the father of his Christian converts (1st Thess. 2:10-11). Acts calls Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and David fathers (4:25, 7:2, 8, 14). Paul says Timothy is his son, and he (Paul) is Timothy's father (Philip. 2:22). Reading Hebrews 12:9 reminds us of those spankings we used to get from our fathers! 1st John 2:13, 14 twice calls certain members of the congregation fathers.
Every Catholic priest is ordained in Christ to say, "In Christ Jesus I became your father through the Gospel" (1st Cor. 4:15). A priest is sent "to deal with us as a father deals with his children, encouraging, comforting, and urging us to live lives worthy of God" (1st Thess. 2:11-12).
Catholics believe the fulcrum of Mat 23:9-10 is "The greatest among you will be your servant." (Mat 23:11) That is the job of the priest, to be a servant. To serve the congregation. Jesus was condemning their hypocrisy, not their office.
Catholics don't think Jesus was against priests, he was against hypocritical priests. Jesus was condemning the hypocrisy of unholy men who were in office at the time, he was not condemning their office. I believe that's how God felt 2000 years ago and that is how he feels today. And yes there have always been some bad priests. Judas was the first bad priest in the Christian tradition, but the other disciples were good men. Jesus makes it very clear that he is not condemning the office of scribes and Pharisees'. He was not saying that we should throw out the idea of an organized clergy. He had a great respect for their office.
"The scribes and the Pharisees sit on Moses seat; therefore do whatever they teach you and follow it, " (Mat 23:2)
So we be live Jesus was saying, honour the office of the priesthood. God honoured the office and gave the high priest the gift of prophesy (Jn 11:51) God instituted the priesthood with the Levites. Jesus was not against the priesthood, he honoured and respected it, and I believe he is inviting us to do the same. God gave the high priest the gift of prophesy (Jn 11:51)
Sorry about the long answer but links aren't working tonight.
1 Corinthians 4:14-16 (New International Version)
14I am not writing this to shame you, but to warn you, as my dear children. 15Even though you have ten thousand guardians in Christ, you do not have many fathers, for in Christ Jesus I became your father through the gospel. 16Therefore I urge you to imitate me.
1 John 2:13a I write unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning.
1 Corinthians 4:15 For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.
So either Jesus' words have another meaning besides the literal one, or else two of the New Testament's most prolific and respected authors fouled up and used the "Father" word to refer to spiritual leaders.
You tell me which is the more likely of the two scenarios.
Edit:
So what your edit is telling me is that you didn't really want to know why Catholics or anyone else use the term "Father" for a spiritual leader. In that case, why did you even bother to ask the question if you already knew the answer that you wanted?
You simply wanted a place to air your views, that's all. You wasted my time and Y!A's bandwidth with a question that had no purpose except to "prove" that you're right and we're wrong.
Matt. 23:9 - Jesus says, "call no man father." But Protestants use this verse in an attempt to prove that it is wrong for Catholics to call priests "father." This is an example of "eisegesis" (imposing one's views upon a passage) as opposed to "exegesis" (drawing out the meaning of the passage from its context). In this verse, Jesus was discouraging His followers from elevating the scribes and Pharisees to the titles of fathers and rabbis because they were hypocrites. Jesus warns us not to elevate anyone to the level of our heavenly Father.
Matt. 23:8 in this teaching, Jesus also says not to call anyone teacher or rabbi as well. But don t Protestants call their teachers teacher? What about this commandment of Jesus? When Protestants say call no man father, they must also argue that we cannot call any man teacher either.
Judges 17:10; 18:19 - priesthood and fatherhood have always been identified together. Fatherhood literally means "communicating one's nature," and just as biological fathers communicate their nature to their children, so do spiritual fathers communicate the nature of God to us, their children, through (hopefully) teaching and example.
Eph. 3:14-15 - every family in heaven and on earth is named from the "Father." We are fathers in the Father.
Acts 7:2; 22:1,1 John 2:13 - elders of the Church are called "fathers." Therefore, we should ask the question, "Why don't Protestants call their pastors "father?"
1 Cor. 4:15 - Paul writes, "I became your father in Christ Jesus."
1 Cor. 4:17 - Paul calls Bishop Timothy a beloved and faithful "child" in the Lord.
2 Cor. 12:14 - Paul describes his role as parent over his "children" the Corinthians.
Phil. 2:22 - Paul calls Timothy's service to him as a son serves a "father."
1 Thess. 2:11- Paul compares the Church elders' ministry to the people like a father with his children.
1 Tim. 1:2,18; 2 Tim. 1:2-3 - Paul calls Timothy his true "child" in the faith and his son.
Titus 1:4 - Paul calls Titus his true "child" in a common faith. Priests are our spiritual fathers in the family of God.
Philemon 10 - Paul says he has become the "father" of Onesimus.
Heb. 12:7,9 - emphasizes our earthly "fathers." But these are not just biological but also spiritual (the priests of the Church).
1 Peter 5:13 - Peter refers to himself as father by calling Mark his "son."
1 John 2:1,13,14 - John calls the elders of the Church "fathers."
1 John 2:1,18,28; 3:18; 5:21; 3 John 4 - John calls members of the Church "children."
1 Macc. 2:65 - Mattathias the priest tells his sons that Simeon will be their "father."
The Lord, Mary, the Apostles and Others Refer to Spiritual Leaders as "Fathers"
Matt. 3:9; Luke 3:8 - Jesus refers to Abraham as our "father."
Mark 11:10 - the people cried out blessed is the kingdom of our "father" David that is coming!
Luke 1:32 - God's angel says Jesus will be great and be given the throne of his "father" David.
Luke 1:55 - Mary says that He spoke to our "fathers," to Abraham and to his posterity for ever.
Luke 1:73 - Zechariah says the oath which he swore to our "father" Abraham.
Luke 16:24,30 - Jesus, in His parable about the rich man, says our "father" Abraham.
John 4:12 - the Samaritan woman asks Jesus if He is greater than our "father" Jacob.
John 7:22 - Jesus refers to the "fathers" who gave the Jews the practice of circumcision.
John 8:56 - Jesus tells the Jews your "Father" Abraham rejoiced that he was to see my day.
Acts 3:13,25; 5:30 - Peter teaches that the God of our "fathers" glorified His servant Jesus and raised Him to life.
Acts 4:25 - Peter and John pray to God and refer to our "father" David.
Acts 7:11-12, 15,19,38,44-45,51-52 - Stephen refers to our "fathers" in the faith.
Acts 7:32 - Stephen calls God the God of our "fathers."
Acts 13:17,32,36; 24:14; 26:6; 28:17,25 - Paul also refers to the God of our "fathers" in the faith.
Acts 22:3 - Paul says he was educated according to the strict law of our "fathers."
Acts 22:14 - Ananias says the God of our "fathers."
Rom. 4:1 - Paul calls Abraham our "forefather."
Rom. 4:16-17 - Paul says that Abraham is the "father" of us all and the "father" of many nations.
Rom. 9:10 - Paul calls Isaac, a spiritual leader, our "forefather."
1 Cor. 10:1 - Paul says that our "fathers" were all under the cloud, referring to the Old Testament spiritual leaders.
Gal. 1:14 - Paul says that he was zealous for the tradition of his "fathers."
2 Tim. 1:3 - Paul thanks God whom he serves with a clear conscience as did his "fathers" in faith.
Heb. 1:1 - the author says God spoke of old to our "fathers."
Heb. 3:9 - the Holy Spirit says that your "fathers" put me to the test.
Heb. 8:9 - God says not like the covenant that I made with their "fathers."
James 2:21 - James says was not our "father" Abraham justified by works when he offered his son Isaac?
1 Peter 1:18 - Peter says you were ransomed from the futile ways inherited from your "fathers."
2 Peter 3:4 - Peter says ever since the "fathers" fell asleep, all things have continued as they were from the beginning.
Other Examples Where Jesus Uses the Word "Father" When Teaching
Matt. 15:4-5; 19:19 - Jesus uses "father" when He teaches God's commandment to "Honor your father and your mother."
Mark 7:10-12; Luke 18:20 - these are more examples of Jesus using "father" when teaching about honoring our fathers and mothers.
Eph. 6:2,4 - Paul also teaches to honor your "father" and mother, and says "fathers," do not provoke your children.
Matt. 10:21; 35,37; Mark 13:12 - Jesus says "father" will deliver up his child in the last days.
Matt. 19:5; Mark 10:7,19 - Jesus says a man shall leave his "father" and mother and be joined to his wife. See also Eph. 5:31.
Matt. 19:29; Mark 10:29-30 - Jesus says whoever has left mother or "father" for His sake shall receive a hundredfold.
Matt. 21:31 - Jesus uses "father" when he teaches about the parable of the two sons and asks, "who did the will of his "father?"
Luke 6:23,26 - Jesus speaks about reward and punishment with reference to what their "fathers" did to the prophets.
Luke 11:11 - Jesus says what "father" among you will give his child a serpent when he asks for a fish.
Luke 11:47-48 - Jesus tells the lawyers they are witnesses to the deeds of their "fathers."
Luke 14:26 - Jesus says we must leave our "fathers" and mothers and come to him, or we cannot be His disciple.
Luke 15:12,17-18,20-22,27-29 - Jesus repeatedly uses "father" when teaching about the prodigal son.
Luke 16:27 - Jesus uses "father" when teaching about the rich man in purgatory.
John 6:49,58 - Jesus says your "fathers" ate the manna in the wilderness and died.
I urge you go to this official web site for further details:
http://www.catholic.com/library/Call_No_...
'My bible says this..' and 'My bible says that'
person.....
Then you should not be calling the male parent who created you your father either. Find another word for him. Its evil.
Comon you don't take John 6 this literally and it is much much more clear on what it is saying than this.
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